First, unless you are the button or have a good read on the others I don't like the call preflop. Raise or fold. Second, if you are going to CALL all in, you would be better RAISING all in first. Thirdly, with at least 2 others all in the pot before you're betting again, one may already have a boat and you're drawing to 1 card, and/or the other may have your outs and/or a bigger draw. So #1 fold preflop. #2 raise all in or fold. Just my opionion, I'm still learning.
- VIEW PROFILE
- MY PROFILE
- WINNERS
- PLAYERS
- BLOGS
- CREATE A BLOG
- COMMUNITY FAQ
- LEADERBOARDS
- THIS WEEK
- THIS MONTH
- THIS YEAR
I need help with this live tournament hand that I played
By RanoeDec 29, 08 12:58 AM

Any feedback would be appreciated. Live tournament $550 buy-in, 6K starting chips, 30 minute levels. Paying 18 places. 1st Place is $40K. 205 players started; down to 145 with average stack at 8.5K. 4th level 100-200 with 25 ante. Blinds to 200-400 ante 25 in about 8minutes. Total of 7 players including me in the cut-off are in the pot for 200 each. I started the hand with $4.7K stack and Qs 9s. Flop: Js Jh 8s. It is checked to middle player (P5) who also has $4.5K stack; he bets 500. (P6) folds. I call. Button, with about 20K raises all-in. Players fold. Back to (P5) who calls all-in with his remaining $4K. I also call with my remaining $4K. Turn: 6d. River: 6h. I go home. Both other players had a J for a full boat. My question is: Was I right or wrong to have called the all-in? Please explain your answer. Thanks.


COMMENTS
My thought is that a flush draw is a coin flip, since the board was paired an all in most likely hit the pair. Many times I called a large bet and then someone after me went all in, your stuck. In looking at the board I would have to say to myself am I getting my money in right and in my way of thinking a coin flip is not it. Also if you did get the flush one more pr on river makes it a boat which washes your flush. I don't like to gamble and would rather choose a better spot.
With a all in raise and a call ahead of you also is an indication your beat from the start so back to do you want to gamble. I think the lessen here is go back to what you were considering at the time it happened. Did you think, I can hit the flush I'm in, or did you consider all of the hand possibilities which could take your chips. If you play omaha and consider all of the hand possibilities and at showdown a glance can tell you who won it sharpens your skill under pressure to make all conside
I would say its an clear fold in this spot. Its not a good idea to draw to a flush when the board is paired. If they have a boat or quads u have 1 out ..... ten of spades, which could have been in the muck already. Two all-ins in front of you would have to conclude atleast some1 has 3 Js . Make the fold. this is how we get better though. Siyuations like this only make your next decision easier.
I agree w 940. With 6 people in pot ahead of u (counting blinds) Q9 (suited does not count) is NOT a hand I would have even called the flop with. U still have 10X BB even after blinds go up. Be patient. Wait for a better starting hand and then push it hard. An old poker axium; "If u aint raisin, u aint winnin". MHO, for what its worth.
I think your pre-flop call was good.Your $500 call was slightly bad,as you could be raised,or called by a higher flush draw.The 4k call gave you a 32% chance to win if they both had only a J at that point.I think your winning chances were below 25%,4K to win 11k,not quite enough.
I don't love your preflop call, but I can live with it given your position. I would have easily folded to the flop bet though, as you are quite possibly drawing to a one outer if someone has a higher flush draw, and are not in very good shape if even one person has a jack. Not a good spot in my opinion.
In my opinion, your first mistake was playing two cards that are a 2 gapper. Being suited only gives you a 4% advantage at best. Mirek78 is exactly right you should have never been in this hand from the beginning. Remember those who chase str8s and flushes go home on buses. It did not matter what came over on the flop, you should have folded before you even called any bet.
7 preflop callers in this size of tourny? That's crazy. Where is this tournament held? I wouldn't mind making a quick 40k! On a serious note, you have to raise or fold preflop. You absolutely cannot call with that hand with that many other players in an unraised pot. Even if you hit a flush you're going broke against Ace Rag or King Junk of the same suit.
Well with 8 players preflop with Qs 9s, yeah your fishing for a flush out there, with that many players and pot odds playing, yes a call here is okay because your 8 to 1 on money and that make any two cards playable, on the flop yes you got your flush draw, but there is a pair out there. the first all in move by the blinds could be a good steal move, with steel in his blood, now the call all in prior to you is a 'alarm bell' screaming red alert, red alert, you really should have folded at this p




DrCheckRaise
I would think that with all that action in front you you that you might have even considered that you were drawing dead. It was completly possible that someone had pocket 8 or J 8 and at the very least a Jack in which case even if you did hit your flush you were dead if the board paired or if they hit their other whole card to go with their Jack. Please don't bring up your Str8 Flush possibility, I mean that is never a consideration to draw at.